Was the NYS Federation really at fault for LuHi Loss?

[mwingate]

On Friday, a clerical error cost Long Island Lutheran the NYS Federation Semifinal game and perhaps their first championship. At first, I felt that the Federation was totally at fault but after a good night’s sleep and the application of some common sense, now I believe there’s plenty of blame to go around. The only thing the NYS Federation is guilty of is enlisting an inept scorekeeper.who was 75 years old more or less.5 years

Clearly, LuHi had an additional time-out and was incorrectly penalized with a technical foul with 8.3 seconds left to play which cost them the game but unfortunately there’s a NYS Federation rule in place that does not allow protests and therefore no recourse after a game is over. Is the rule fair? No. Does the protest rule need to be changed? Yes (Protests are allowed in the PSAL and CHSAA). But that’s something that can only be changed before or after a season. It can’t be changed right after a game because a team is unhappy with the result.

Clerical errors happen all the time in high school basketball whether it’s points scored, team fouls or time-outs left. Why? Because stats are usually done by volunteers and not by professionals. Nowadays teams have seemingly hundreds of assistant coaches. I usually see assistant coaches scouring over and reconciling official scorebooks with their scorebooks after quarters and halves, checking and double-checking stats. Why didn’t a LuHi assistant coach pick up on the time out called by R.J. Davis at the 5:29 mark of the first quarter that was incorrectly assessed to LuHi? That error remained on the books unchecked for over 24 hours. Imagine if the Crusaders would have addressed discrepancy at the end of the first quarter or the half or at least when the incorrect tech was assessed with 8.3 secs left in the game?

It wasn’t Stepinac’s job to alert anyone of the clerical error. It was L.I. Lutheran’s job to be more meticulous when it came to checking the books and identifying the error same as they would with team fouls etc.. Especially with a “no protest” rule in place.

Basketball is played on and off the court. Winning teams pay attention to details. I was watching a 30 for 30 movie called “The Two Bills”. Bill Parcells said what he liked most about Bill Belichick was how detailed oriented he was. He left no stone unturned before or during a game. That’s why the New England Patriots (Love ‘em or hate ‘em) win so damn much.

We did a poll where we asked, what should be done about that clerical error? Most people said that the 8.3 seconds should be replayed with the scored tied at 72 but that would’ve been against the rules, same as a shot clock violation or any other rule.

Bottomline. This should’ve been avoided even with the clerical error. Stepinac wins. No asterisk required. IMHO.

Thoughts?

 

[NYMetroHoops]

Very good points...

 

[dakidknuckles]

Why do you say the error caused "Luhi the federation semifinal game". That statement is a smack in the face to Stepinac, as it implies that despite the score being tied, with 8 seconds left, Luhi would've won. Stepinac deserves great credit for the championship as they truly earned it by defeating larger known schools and players. Also, most coaches know that over the course of an entire game, from start to finish, there are many mishaps that can occur that will contribute to a loss but, the mishap that occurs in the final moments are the ones highlighted by a coach or fan of the losing team. That's called not taking responsibility and can be viewed as unsportsmanlike. What Luhi did was disgraceful and not a teaching moment for the players involved in their program.

 

[mwingate]

Why do you say the error caused "Luhi the federation semifinal game". That statement is a smack in the face to Stepinac, as it implies that despite the score being tied, with 8 seconds left, Luhi would've won. Stepinac deserves great credit for the championship as they truly earned it by defeating larger known schools and players. Also, most coaches know that over the course of an entire game, from start to finish, there are many mishaps that can occur that will contribute to a loss but, the mishap that occurs in the final moments are the ones highlighted by a coach or fan of the losing team. That's called not taking responsibility and can be viewed as unsportsmanlike. What Luhi did was disgraceful and not a teaching moment for the players involved in their program.

I didn't say LuHi would've won if not for the clerical error but they definitely lost because of it argo . My hat goes off to Stepinac for a well played game both on and off the court. They deserved the win that's why I said "Stepinac won, no asterisk necessary.".

 

[getbuckets10]

What you are failing to cite is major. In the NFHS rule book, which governs the tournament, Rule 2, Section 7, Article 12 states that an officials' duty is to "notify the head coach when a team is granted its final allowable time out". This never happened. This rule is a check and balance put in place so that this situation never occurs. Egregiously, it did not happen at the highest level in the state. To ignore this is negligent. Additionally, Rule 2, Section 11, Article 6 states that the scorer's duties include "recording the time-out information charged to each team and notify a team and its coach, through an official, whenever that team is granted its final allotted charged time-out." Did this happen? Did the scorer inform the lead official that a final timeout (although incorrectly charged) had been taken previously to the one in question with 8.3 seconds remaining? The LuHi bench was never informed. If we are going to stand by the no protest rule, then what about these rules that are in place but were never followed? Pick and choose? Nothing subjective here, these are facts.

 

[mwingate]

What you are failing to cite is major. In the NFHS rule book, which governs the tournament, Rule 2, Section 7, Article 12 states that an officials' duty is to "notify the head coach when a team is granted its final allowable time out". This never happened. This rule is a check and balance put in place so that this situation never occurs. Egregiously, it did not happen at the highest level in the state. To ignore this is negligent. Additionally, Rule 2, Section 11, Article 6 states that the scorer's duties include "recording the time-out information charged to each team and notify a team and its coach, through an official, whenever that team is granted its final allotted charged time-out." Did this happen? Did the scorer inform the lead official that a final timeout (although incorrectly charged) had been taken previously to the one in question with 8.3 seconds remaining? The LuHi bench was never informed. If we are going to stand by the no protest rule, then what about these rules that are in place but were never followed? Pick and choose? Nothing subjective here, these are facts.

All the rules and duties you cited are ultimately short-circuited by the barbaric "no protest" rule and an unfortunate "no going back to the videotape" rule therefore self-policing during the game becomes to the only effective recourse a team has. This solution is unfortunate, draconian and a pain-in-the-neck for coaches, assistant coaches, managers etc. but it's now the sad reality going forward.

I'm sure few coaches were aware of the obscure "no protest" rule but I bet they all know it now and you can also bet that score books and all stats will be checked, rechecked and checked again going forward. They say, in God we trust. All other pay cash.

While hindsight is always 20-20, if I were a high school coach in NYS, I wouldn't trust the process anymore. I'd watch my own back during a game.

 

[dakidknuckles]

Good points regarding the rules have been made. That aside, I agree with the publisher, with the amount of assistant coaches on Luhi's sideline, why wasn't this picked up by one of them. Most high school, college, aau, and pro coaches, utilize their assistant coaches for various duties, including keeping track of fouls for each team....My point is, 31 minutes and 52 seconds were played before the technical was issued. Luhi's protest is based on a call that was made with 8 seconds left. Luhi clearly had more veterans on their roster and frankly, shouldn't have been in a position where a technical decided the game. Stepinac's path to the championship included victories over Christ The King, Molloy and Luhi. Give credit where credit is due. It is insulting and undignified to wine over a loss that was served by a very deserving team. What's scary is that Stepinac has two outstanding sophomores, who are exceptionally talented, confident and should dominate New York for the next two years.

 

[SillyWabbit]

Wait what? Did no one check the books at the half? I bet stepinac did.